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Author Topic: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD  (Read 281 times)

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Offline midnight_lightning

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Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« on: 22:51:54, 13 June, 2017 »
Hi,

This follows two earlier posts where I was trying to decide whether to go CCD. I have now decided to go Mono CCD and would be grateful for comment/feedback on the choices I am looking at which are:

•Atik 490 EX (Sample 1.9”/Pix)
•Atik EFW2 Filter Wheel – 7 filter holder (?)
•Baader LRGB filters

But I have a few questions:

•There are a couple of similar cameras (QHY23 and Trius – SX814) which are cheaper, have lower cooling and in one case a USB hub which would be useful. I have gone for the Atik because I was picking up a consensus in various forums that the Atik was getting good feedback for reliabilty and customer service so I would be interested to know how people have got on with all of these cameras.

•What size filters, what filter wheel capacity, which specific Baader “model” of filters or other make? I am thinking 7 filter wheel (Ian Ranking has a bundle which includes LRGB, HA, OIII, SII) - however it uses the Xagyl wheel which I believe is over 800g. My DSLR is around 850g and I already have to put 400g weight on the front of my Esprit to get balance - so, with the 490 being around 400g I Ideally need a light weight filter wheel.

I would also be interested to know whether people take lights after each filter change and whether it is necessary to re-focus. I know regular refocussing is advisable due to temperature change but with our weather I was wondering whether I could take LRGB, LRGB, LRGB sequences to ensure I at least have a full set if the clouds roll in.

Finally, I have attached a couple of previously posted images (probably my best efforts so far) taken with my un-modded DSLR. The reason I want to go CCD is partially to get more detail in my images but also to lose the IR filter which makes some targets difficult. The set up I am proposing is the sort of money I would usually spend on a car, so I would be interested whether people think I should, with practice, be able to improve on these images with the CCD (I know my processing also need improvement - particularly on M42)?


All suggestions welcome.


Thanks

Mid


HEQ5 Pro, Esprit Pro 80/400, Sky Watcher 9x50 Guide Scope with Lodestar X2 (PHD2), Nikon D750 Un-modded (BYN), IDAS D1 LPS.

Online Celestron8g8

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #1 on: 22:56:59, 13 June, 2017 »
Really nice captures .
-Ron

Can't learn if you don't ask , First step is the starting point !!

Offline Einari

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #2 on: 06:03:56, 14 June, 2017 »
First of all, those are very good images. More so if taken with unmodded camera.
Don't know if it would be better (detailed) with mono camera. But mono camera wins especially for narrowband imaging and fainter targets.

Now about questions and choices.
I have been very happy with Starlight Xpress cameras, using SXV-9C and now SXV-694.
Like about they good quality, usb hub is bonus (would use it if my mount didn't have usb hub), like about tilt possibility which sometimes is handy. Also always have good good support (although don't know if it's too much relied on single person...).
But I'm sure Atik is equally good. Have used Atik camera as well and was very pleased with it.
With QHY less satisfied and main reason was drivers/software.

1.25" filters is good enough for quite big sensors, and will do fine with that Atik.
Many use 7 filter wheels and for good reason.
So far I have been fine with only 5. I only have Ha and OIII (+RGB), so have RGB+Ha in wheel and use OIII in nosepiece if I need it.
Have noticed that I can do with same focus with RGB, L is different (and ideally one of the RGB could do slightly different focus).
Also flats should be taken after every filter but sometimes I cut corners using same flat for all RGB.
Hope this helps.
Tapio

Celestron C8, C9.25" & Hyperstar, iOptron CEM60-EC, TS 80 triplet,  Coronado PST, SXV-694,  ASI120MM/ASI174MC Cool

Offline Nomis Elfactem

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #3 on: 14:45:20, 14 June, 2017 »
I can echo Tapio on all points.

You'll get first class service from both Atik (who are member of here so see everything you say/ask) as well as Steve at Starlight Xpress (who is also a member on here !).  You'll not be sorry with either.

I, like Tapio, have the SX694.  Mine's pre trius unfortunately as the USB hub is very useful indeed  - anything to reduce the risk of wire snags and weight !

Again, as Tapio says, those images are very good for an ummodded DSLR but the fact is that the IR filter is removing a lot of useful data all of which you'll capture with a dedicated CCD.

The final thing to say is that we've all been there when it comes to morning the loss of real-estate when switching from imaging with a DSLR to a cooled CCD, but I can promise you, as soon as the first sub comes out of your dedicated / set-point cooled / no broadband IR filter camera it will soon be forgotten ! The simple fact is that DSLR's will never match a cooled chip astro CCD, end of.

S.
Simon

Scopes: Astro-Tech AT-111EDT Triplet, TS65ED Quad, Orion ST80, Modded PST-90 Solar Scope, PST Cak (on loan)
Cameras: SXVF H694, Atik 16ic, Canon EOS 600d, DMK41, DMK21, QHY 5L-II (mono & colour)
Accessories: SX USB Filter Wheel, SX OAG, Baader LRGB Ha SI OII Filters, SharpSky Focuser
Mount: EQ6 (EQMOD), SW Star Adventurer, plus a lot (and I mean a lot) of other bits and pieces

Offline midnight_lightning

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #4 on: 20:56:21, 14 June, 2017 »
Thanks for those replies that's really helped firm up on cameras.

I'm still unsure about which filter wheel to go for, any views welcome.

Cheers

Mid
HEQ5 Pro, Esprit Pro 80/400, Sky Watcher 9x50 Guide Scope with Lodestar X2 (PHD2), Nikon D750 Un-modded (BYN), IDAS D1 LPS.

Offline Nomis Elfactem

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #5 on: 21:02:23, 14 June, 2017 »
Generally go for the one that's tied in with the camera of choice (i.e. if you get a Atik camera, get the Atik filter wheel) particularly as they often come bundles together so will save you a few pennies.

S.
Simon

Scopes: Astro-Tech AT-111EDT Triplet, TS65ED Quad, Orion ST80, Modded PST-90 Solar Scope, PST Cak (on loan)
Cameras: SXVF H694, Atik 16ic, Canon EOS 600d, DMK41, DMK21, QHY 5L-II (mono & colour)
Accessories: SX USB Filter Wheel, SX OAG, Baader LRGB Ha SI OII Filters, SharpSky Focuser
Mount: EQ6 (EQMOD), SW Star Adventurer, plus a lot (and I mean a lot) of other bits and pieces

Offline Skipper Billy

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #6 on: 20:49:38, 15 June, 2017 »
The Atik EFW2 is one of the few astro items that I have ever bought that has never given me a moments grief - it just works and works and works.......
Scopes - 130 Heritage, ES 208mm f3.9 Carbon Hex astrograph, SW ED80 and SW ST80 for guiding
Mount - Skywatcher AZ-EQ6-GT
Cameras - Cameras - Atik 460EX mono and Lodestar for guiding
Website www.davidbanksastro.com

Offline midnight_lightning

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #7 on: 13:51:01, 17 June, 2017 »
That's good to know, although I'm now looking at going Starlight expresss with sx814 and their USB FW.
Mid
HEQ5 Pro, Esprit Pro 80/400, Sky Watcher 9x50 Guide Scope with Lodestar X2 (PHD2), Nikon D750 Un-modded (BYN), IDAS D1 LPS.

Offline Annie

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #8 on: 17:25:54, 17 June, 2017 »
Did you see the Sky at Night review of the SX Trius H814?

Annie

Offline midnight_lightning

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #9 on: 15:46:13, 18 June, 2017 »
No Annie, I missed that, will look it up now.
Thanks for the heads up.

Mid
HEQ5 Pro, Esprit Pro 80/400, Sky Watcher 9x50 Guide Scope with Lodestar X2 (PHD2), Nikon D750 Un-modded (BYN), IDAS D1 LPS.

Online chris.bailey

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #10 on: 17:45:17, 18 June, 2017 »

[/quote]
That's good to know, although I'm now looking at going Starlight expresss with sx814 and their USB FW.
Mid

If you are going to do that you might as well get the FW with OAG head. Works very well and you already have the Lodestar.
LX200|ZS70|FSQ85|FLT110|Altair DF250RC|EQ6 Pro(Rowan Belt Mod)|ParamountMX
ATIK383L+/EFW2/OAG|Lodestar|Baader 36mm LRGBHaSIIOIII
Starlight Express SXVRH16/ONAG/FW|Lodestar X2|Baader 2" Filters
Starlight Express SXVRH814/ONAG/FW|LodestarX2|Baader 2" Filters
Lunt LS60PTBF1200|DMK41|Quark Chromo

Offline midnight_lightning

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #11 on: 13:18:22, 19 June, 2017 »
I was wondering about that Chris, I think the bundles with OAG are just for the mini USB wheel which is 5 position. Perhaps this is adequate but I was thinking of getting the 7 position wheel with LRGB, HA, OIII and SII which would allow me to keep them all loaded.
HEQ5 Pro, Esprit Pro 80/400, Sky Watcher 9x50 Guide Scope with Lodestar X2 (PHD2), Nikon D750 Un-modded (BYN), IDAS D1 LPS.

Offline Nomis Elfactem

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #12 on: 15:22:15, 20 June, 2017 »
Pretty sure they'll do a good deal on a OAG, 7pos filter wheel and CCD.... that's what I have... you won't be disappointed (after you've climbed the image processing curve  ;)) :thumbup:
Simon

Scopes: Astro-Tech AT-111EDT Triplet, TS65ED Quad, Orion ST80, Modded PST-90 Solar Scope, PST Cak (on loan)
Cameras: SXVF H694, Atik 16ic, Canon EOS 600d, DMK41, DMK21, QHY 5L-II (mono & colour)
Accessories: SX USB Filter Wheel, SX OAG, Baader LRGB Ha SI OII Filters, SharpSky Focuser
Mount: EQ6 (EQMOD), SW Star Adventurer, plus a lot (and I mean a lot) of other bits and pieces

Offline midnight_lightning

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #13 on: 20:54:03, 20 June, 2017 »
Well it cant hurt to ask   ;)

Nice rig you have there, do you leave it set up on the pier all the time? I have to set up completely each night and I'm wondering if I put a pier somewhere it would make the set up easier? I read somewhere that someone had set one up to look like a garden ornament (sundial) and just took the top off and added the mount.

Wife my go for that  :surprise:
HEQ5 Pro, Esprit Pro 80/400, Sky Watcher 9x50 Guide Scope with Lodestar X2 (PHD2), Nikon D750 Un-modded (BYN), IDAS D1 LPS.

Offline Nomis Elfactem

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Re: Moving from DSLR to Mono CCD
« Reply #14 on: 22:53:45, 20 June, 2017 »
do you leave it set up on the pier all the time?

Yeap, it's inside an observatory so I just close the roof and wait for the next clear spell.
Simon

Scopes: Astro-Tech AT-111EDT Triplet, TS65ED Quad, Orion ST80, Modded PST-90 Solar Scope, PST Cak (on loan)
Cameras: SXVF H694, Atik 16ic, Canon EOS 600d, DMK41, DMK21, QHY 5L-II (mono & colour)
Accessories: SX USB Filter Wheel, SX OAG, Baader LRGB Ha SI OII Filters, SharpSky Focuser
Mount: EQ6 (EQMOD), SW Star Adventurer, plus a lot (and I mean a lot) of other bits and pieces

 

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